Ally Langdon and Bill Shorten clash as interview gets heated: ‘That’s not right’

Former Labor leader Bill Shorten has faced a heated interview following accusations he is not doing enough to crack down on fraudsters cheating the system.

Shorten, the minister responsible for National Disability Insurance, said this A current issue‘s Ally Langdon is doing everything she can to hold criminals accountable Monday evening.

His interview was preceded by an emotional story about an NDIS provider, Denise Clissold, who is accused of taking money from the multi-billion dollar disability assistance program for herself.

Introducing the story to Mr Shorten, Langdon said: “Concerns about this woman were raised to the NDIS committee months ago. She has not been banned. Now she should clearly lose her job – and some might say the same about you.”

“I don’t know where you come to that conclusion, the second part, Ally, but I think it’s your job to say that,” Mr Shorten replied.

“It is my job to ensure that these crooks and thugs are not part of the NDIS. The reality is, that interview you showed makes my blood boil.

‘These people are being investigated. I’d like to tell you that tonight I can click my fingers and banish all the bad people. That would be the best outcome. But we have to go through a fair process.”

Langdon was unhappy with Mr Shorten’s response and argued an investigation ‘could take months’.

“Aren’t we protecting the wrong person here?” she said.

‘She has no ban. She hasn’t even been suspended, Minister.’

Mr Shorten replied: ‘Yes, you said that before, and I understand that.

“I tell you that I went to our investigators and said, ‘It seems like a pretty open and shut case’ and they said, ‘Minister, we have to go through the processes.’

“But the fact is that I don’t think what we’ve seen with this individual is an isolated example. When I became minister two years ago, I was shocked by the fact that very little attention was paid to detecting fraud, catching criminals, and getting rid of them.

‘We have doubled the number of researchers in the past two years. We said: there were no systems to catch people. There was no way to check if claims were inflated, duplicated or even ghosted.

“The tools we had when I became minister were not sufficient to oversee the plan, so we are making changes in Parliament as we talk to improve fraud detection and prevention.”

But Langdon pressed further: “So do you think the NDIS is in good shape at the moment?”

Mr Shorten defended the service system, saying: ‘It is changing lives and doing great work.’

‘I think the truth is that a majority of service providers are probably doing the right thing, but there is a minority who seem to see it as their God-given right to deceive disabled people, investors and taxpayers, and they don’t – they do it for themselves,” he said.

Langdon responded, “But if you can’t even stop a provider like the one we just explained in this story, I’d say the system is failing.”

Mr Shorten responded with claims he has dramatically increased funding for investigations into NDIS fraud and took a swipe at Langdon for her pointed questions.

“The other thing I have to say, Ally, and this might go against a little bit of your typical style of journalism: this argument that these cases mean the plan is broken, the plan is not broken,” he said .

“Unfortunately, this great Australian tradition includes a section of the community who believe they have a God-given right to take taxpayers’ money and rip off people with disabilities, but that’s not the whole story.

“I’m grateful that you’re addressing these issues. I actually mean that. Because it only draws attention to the crooks. But what we also have to do is…’

Langdon interrupted, “But then we can’t even stop the bad guys. That’s the fundamental problem.’

Mr Shorten became frustrated and told her: ‘That’s not right, Ally.

“Just because an investigation didn’t convict people on your show tonight doesn’t mean we reject due process.

“One thing I won’t do is let a thug go, Ally, just to grab a quick bite here tonight.”

Langdon tried to interrupt again, but Mr Shorten quickly told her, “No no, wait a minute. You’ve had it.

“You wanted me to get rid of the bad guys. I get up every morning and do it. We go after this every morning.

‘But what we have to do is get the budget done. We have that now. Get the people. We accept them. We must have the right technology to investigate the claims. And I have to put the laws into effect.

‘I’m glad you’re interested in this matter. But you know, you had a bit of a dig at me before, that you’ve been hounding me for months to get on the show – you interviewed me 100 times on the Today show when you were there, you never once brought up the NDIS brought.

“For me, this isn’t just a late-night TV story. For me this is a 24-hour passion.’

Langdon replied, “Wait a minute. Do you want to walk this path?

‘We’re talking to each other now. And let’s think about the people at home who want answers about the NDIS. What we hear from people writing: it’s not happening fast enough. We get emails about the NDIS every day.

“People come to us as a last resort because they feel like the system isn’t listening to them.”

Mr Shorten replied: ‘But you know what? Actually, you make a valid point. And I’ve said before: I’m grateful that you’re exposing this.’

Mr Shorten (pictured) defended his action against ‘crooks’ defrauding the NDIS and criticized Langdon for repeatedly interrupting him

Langdon then steered the interview towards reports that Mr Shorten’s speechwriter has been paid $620,000 over two years, which she described as “a bad look”.

Mr Shorten claimed he is ‘not responsible for negotiating her (the speechwriter’s) contract’ and described the revelation in Parliament on Monday as ‘some kind of cheap Liberal tactic’.

“But the NDIS, which is what you got me here for – I just want to say to your viewers: I hate the thugs. I helped set up the plan. There is no place for these people,” Mr Shorten said.